Traveller-digest     Wednesday, August 11 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 943



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: Relief for Newbies
Re: People's Republic of Berzerkley
Re: Vilani  Stature
RE: Lagrange points
Re: People's Republic of Berzerkley
Re: Relief for Newbies
RE: F****l T*********y
RE: <no comment>
Re: Relief for Newbies
Re: Stats and Skills
Re: Vilani  Stature
RE: Ethically Challenged Merchants
Re: Comment on GT Stuff?
RE: A New Traveller
RE: PRB
RE: People's Republic of Berzerkley
AAFES (was: Re: PRB)
RE: AAFES (was: Re: PRB)
RE: F****l T*********y
RE: Ethically Challenged Merchants
A defence against near C rocks
Re: A defence against near C rocks
Holy Jump Torps Batman! (Was RE: Relief for Newbies)
RE: A defence against near C rocks
HEPlaR vs T-Plates
Re: Planetology 102 Part 8
Re: HEPlaR vs T-Plates
Re: A defence against near C rocks

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:08:39
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <dberry@hooked.net>
Subject: Re: Relief for Newbies

At 11:11 AM 8/11/99 -0400, you wrote:

>5. I have no idea at all about the Lesbian Aslan (aka female Aslan in
>comfy shoes).  Some folks around here are just strange... 

That one arose from the 3:1 ratio of femal to male Aslan.  Some of us
wonderered is bisexuality might be the norm for female Aslan, and off it
went...
- --

Douglas E. Berry, dberry@hooked.net
Inquisitor Maximus
Reformed Canon Church of Sylea
http://jump.to/SyleaDownport

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:09:30 -0700
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu>
Subject: Re: People's Republic of Berzerkley

Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:
> 
> > There's surely an Ob Traveller in there somewhere.
>
> Do the doggies even bother with clothes?

Of _course_ they do! How _else_ are you going to show off that gorgeous
electric orange and green polka-dot jumpsuit with the tasteful tartan
trimmings? Of course the fur is dyed with irridescent purple and yellow
stripes to match, and to top it off the strobe lights in the hat just
_make_ the whole thing hang together perfectly.

Yeesh...no fashion sense at _all_...just like the _rest_ of the naked
monkeys!


- -- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:23:05 -0700
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu>
Subject: Re: Vilani  Stature

Helge Hudel wrote:
> 
> I disagree on that - since neither H. neandertalensis nor the H.erectus
> were H. sapiens and interbreedings would yield infertile hybrids at
> best.

There is significant debate about _how_ different H. neandetalensis and
H. sapiens truly were, tied into what exactly happened to H.
neandertalensis: were they displaced, out competed, or simply merged?

I can't remember where I saw it, but within the last month I saw an
article discussing genetic similarity of Neandertal man with modern H.
sap.

There are no other members of the Homo genus, so we're not sure, but
there are a number of other genera with quite fertile interspecies
crosses.

Foex: Canis latrans (coyote), Canis lupus (gray wolf), and Canis
familiaris (everything from Rottweilers to chihuahuas) are all quite
happily interfertile yet recognized as different species.

In fact there are serious suggestions that the Red wolf (Canis rufus)
may not be a separate species at all, but a hybrid wolf/coyote.


- -- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:30:58 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: RE: Lagrange points

Douglas E. Berry writes:
>A Lagrange point is a point where the gravitational attraction of two
>massive objects cancel each other.  The Earth and Moon have five
L->points, but the ones we're interested in are L-4 and L-5.  The points
are >60 degrees ahead of and behind the Moon along it's orbit.  Put
something >in those points, and they'll stay there forever. It works
something like >this:
>
>     0 <--Moon
>              * <--L-5  
>
>     *
>    *** <--Planet
>    *** 
>     *
>
>So you will need a large is moon.

	It's time to draw attention to my ignorance of Lagrange 
	points.  O.K., I know that a Lagrange point is a point 
	where the gravity of two masses cancels out, but with my
	feeble understanding of physics I can only imagine one
	such point: directly between the masses (half-way if the 
	masses are equal).  Can somebody sort me out?

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:29:22 -0300
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: People's Republic of Berzerkley

At 09:09 AM 8/11/1999 -0700, you wrote:
>Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:
>> 
>> > There's surely an Ob Traveller in there somewhere.
>>
>> Do the doggies even bother with clothes?
>
>Of _course_ they do! How _else_ are you going to show off that gorgeous
>electric orange and green polka-dot jumpsuit with the tasteful tartan
>trimmings? Of course the fur is dyed with irridescent purple and yellow
>stripes to match, and to top it off the strobe lights in the hat just
>_make_ the whole thing hang together perfectly.
>
>Yeesh...no fashion sense at _all_...just like the _rest_ of the naked
>monkeys!
>

        <Translated from a message sent by a Vargr named Goghuez>
        Actually, that's a common problem with Humans.  They seem to presume
because thier pets have no fashion requirements that anything that evolved
from them doesn't either.  Of course, they forget all the monkeys they keep
in zoos as pets when they do that.
        There's a joke amongst some less racially sensitve Vargr that runs
along the lines that the only difference between a Baboon and a Human is
that the Baboon has figured out there's nothing on the rack that'll make him
look any good, so why bother?  Of course, I frown on that sort of thing.
        Another very good reason that the Chosen Ones *do* wear clothing is
very straight forward.  When you are proud warrior race, as we are, you
learn the value of covering anything you do not wish damaged in armor.  By
the time a culture becomes a star-faring one, technology allows clothing and
light armor to be virtually indistinguishable.  Which is just as well,
because I *hate* literally getting my tail shot off in a nightclub by a
jealous boyfriend.
        Oh, and by the way...   I wouldn't be caught dead in a had with
strobe lights...  that was out of fashion last year.  It's soft red and rust
phosphorescent inset panels in cuffs, collars and hat brims that are all the
rage on Lair right now....
        </end translated text>

        --Michel
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-
	Michel R. Vaillancourt	misha@atlantic-online.ns.ca
				ICQ # 31172292
	"Reality Error in Progress....
			....Do Not Adjust Your Penguin"	
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-
	Into Cyberpunk?  Check Out:
		"http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/cp2020"
	Into Traveller?  Check Out:
		"http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/traveller"
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-
	***REMEMBER - Always virus-check your emails ***
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:34:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca>
Subject: Re: Relief for Newbies

Crap!  I forgot jump torps!  How could I have forgotten the almighty jump
torp wars!?

(You know, it occurs to me that just mentioning all these things is going
to get at least some of them going again.  Have I done a Bad Thing (tm)?)

Charles C.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:38:18 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: RE: F****l T*********y

Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella writes:
<snipped>
>That one has always bothered me.  What the Hierate is a "feudal
>technocracy"?

	For me, the society in "Deathworld II" by Harry Harrison fits
	this nicely.  It is a feudal society with each faction holding
	a monopoly on its own technology (chemistry, electricity, 
	etc.).  YMMV.

	By the way, just what sort of swearing do your PC's and NPC's
	use IYTU?  "What the Hierate" works.

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:41:01 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: <no comment>

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 01:56, Black ICE [SMTP:wombat@premier.net]
wrote:
> Keven, while I agree with you that this is a _highly_ implausible means
> of Virus propagation (even in comparison with all the canonical
> highly-implausible means of propagation), I must salute a referee who
> could sell this method to the group's players.

There was a scene in one of the TSR Buck Rogers books where an 'computer
personality'  (someone who had his personality digitized and ran as a
program) decided to make a more permanent backup of himself.

He used a laser drill to carve a binary representation of his code into a
slab of bedrock.  The idea was that if in the future someone scanned the
carvings into a computer, his program would be brought 'back to life'. 

 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   |   vargr1@jcn1.com
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | dmoody@bridge.com
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:42:55 -0500
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net>
Subject: Re: Relief for Newbies

Charles Collin wrote:
> 
> Crap!  I forgot jump torps!  How could I have forgotten the almighty jump
> torp wars!?

Of _course_ there are jump torps!  They were developed at TL-14 during
the Rule of Man....
> 
> (You know, it occurs to me that just mentioning all these things is going
> to get at least some of them going again.  Have I done a Bad Thing (tm)?)

No, you haven't.  This gives us a chance to discuss these things in a
tongue-in-cheek fashion.

- -- 
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:42:59 -0500
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: Stats and Skills

>         Michael, I have the list in WordPerfect format but I didn't
>         get your e-address.  If you (or anyone else) wants the list,
>         please tip me off.

Please send your list my way.

Alex Ingram

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:44:28 -0700
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com>
Subject: Re: Vilani  Stature

>> I disagree on that - since neither H. neandertalensis nor the H.erectus
>> were H. sapiens and interbreedings would yield infertile hybrids at
>> best.
>
> There is significant debate about _how_ different H. neandetalensis and
> H. sapiens truly were, tied into what exactly happened to H.
> neandertalensis: were they displaced, out competed, or simply merged?
>
> I can't remember where I saw it, but within the last month I saw an
> article discussing genetic similarity of Neandertal man with modern H.
> sap.

There was also an article in either Discovery or Nat. Geo. that covers the
discovery of a possible Neand/Cro hybrid skeleton. Of course many scientists
are contesting this.
BZA
////////////////////////////////////////
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi+  A523
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:48:29 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: Ethically Challenged Merchants

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 02:28, Glenn M. Goffin
[SMTP:gmgoffin@pacbell.net] wrote:
> > From: Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU>
> 
> > One of the other problems of pirate ops - due to the lack of any 
> > interstellar communications faster than ships, it's hard to get 
> > intelligence to a pirate in time for him to do anything about it.
> 
> That didn't stop the pirates of the 16th-18th centuries.  They would
> figure out where a merchant ship should be going at a certain time of
> year and attack it.  Can that be translated to space?  Or maybe I should
> not add anymore gasoline to this frequently-restarted fire.
> 
> --Glenn


Anybody up to bribing a few Xboat pilots?  How about the clerks that recieve
and encript the mail at the post office?


- -DM

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:47:13 -0500
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: Comment on GT Stuff?

I too am a long time Traveller geek and have both run in and game mastered
numerous games using mainly CT and MT universes. I just went out and put
$200 into a number of GT stuff and after review found them to be great
usable source materials that will enhance my present universe. GT has combed
through much of the original Traveller and made many parts clearer and added
more detail. You won't go wrong to get GT.

Alex Ingram

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:49:08 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: A New Traveller

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 02:47, Evyn MacDude
[SMTP:wmacdude@worldnet.att.net] wrote:
> 
> 
> Anthony Salter wrote:
> 
> > >The debates, and debators, can rage all they want, but MTU, is MTU,
> > >so I basically ignore them when they start up.  The same goes for
> > >Virus, lesbian Aslan, and near-c rocks.  ;->
> > >
> > >Eris
> >
> > I am so damn glad I joined this list :)
> >
> > Badman (lesbian Aslan?)
> 
>  K'Kree Bar-b-que...
> 
> Better yet near C rocks...

Hiver cord dogs?


 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   |   vargr1@jcn1.com
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | dmoody@bridge.com
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:56:42 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: PRB

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 02:07, Douglas E. Berry
[SMTP:dberry@hooked.net] wrote:
> Naw, with the expansion of the terran Confederation into space, the
> Army/Air Force Exchange service went with them.  So every world of the
> old
> Vilani Imperium soon had little road side AAFES snack bars selling gut
> grenades and greasy fries.

Oh, God!  Doug, you have awakened many repressed memories of semi-edible
food purchased off the side of a 'Running Chef'.

I'm going to have to go back to therapy now.:-)

> By the time of the Third Imperium, Aafes is a four-star chain of
> resturants.

Hopefully, these stars will be victims of the Darrian Star Trigger.

 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   |   vargr1@jcn1.com
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | dmoody@bridge.com
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:02:10 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: People's Republic of Berzerkley

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 11:10, Bruce Johnson
[SMTP:johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu] wrote:
> Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:
> > 
> > > There's surely an Ob Traveller in there somewhere.
> >
> > Do the doggies even bother with clothes?
> 
> Of _course_ they do! How _else_ are you going to show off that gorgeous
> electric orange and green polka-dot jumpsuit with the tasteful tartan
> trimmings? Of course the fur is dyed with irridescent purple and yellow
> stripes to match, and to top it off the strobe lights in the hat just
> _make_ the whole thing hang together perfectly.
> 
> Yeesh...no fashion sense at _all_...just like the _rest_ of the naked
> monkeys!

That's it!  I finally spewed Dew all over my monkeyboard.
But it was worth it.

Besides, without pockets, where do you keep your jerky treats?

 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   |   vargr1@jcn1.com
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | dmoody@bridge.com
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:16:22 -0500
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net>
Subject: AAFES (was: Re: PRB)

"Moody, Danny M." wrote:
> 
> On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 02:07, Douglas E. Berry
> [SMTP:dberry@hooked.net] wrote:
> > Naw, with the expansion of the terran Confederation into space, the
> > Army/Air Force Exchange service went with them.  So every world of the
> > old
> > Vilani Imperium soon had little road side AAFES snack bars selling gut
> > grenades and greasy fries.
> 
> Oh, God!  Doug, you have awakened many repressed memories of semi-edible
> food purchased off the side of a 'Running Chef'.

During Operation JUST CAUSE, our site at Empire Range had a gut truck
coming by daily, starting on D+6.  AAFES food is better than MREs....
> 
> I'm going to have to go back to therapy now.:-)

You _do_ realize that I'm going to have to develop an AAFES invasion
support ship, with ship's boats for roach coaches, and modular cutters
with the "shoppette" module....

<<snip>>


- -- 
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:35:49 -0500
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com>
Subject: RE: AAFES (was: Re: PRB)

On Wednesday, 11 August 1999 12:16, Black ICE [SMTP:wombat@premier.net]
wrote:
> 
> During Operation JUST CAUSE, our site at Empire Range had a gut truck
> coming by daily, starting on D+6.  AAFES food is better than MREs....

Yeah, in the same way that ebola is better than the bubonic plague...

> > I'm going to have to go back to therapy now.:-)
> 
> You _do_ realize that I'm going to have to develop an AAFES invasion
> support ship, with ship's boats for roach coaches, and modular cutters
> with the "shoppette" module....

And the optional theatre snack-bar upgrade?

www.aafes.com   (I'm not making this up)

Be afraid - be very afraid!


 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   |   vargr1@jcn1.com
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | dmoody@bridge.com
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:58:26 -0500
From: Anthony Salter <badman@austin.rr.com>
Subject: RE: F****l T*********y

>	By the way, just what sort of swearing do your PC's and NPC's
>	use IYTU?  "What the Hierate" works.
>
>Peez

I've always been a fan of "smeg" myself.

Badman

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:00:56 -0500
From: Anthony Salter <badman@austin.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Ethically Challenged Merchants

>Anybody up to bribing a few Xboat pilots?  How about the clerks that recieve
>and encript the mail at the post office?
>
>
>-DM

I suddenly got a vision of "The Sting" set in the Third Imperium...

Badman

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:51:24 +0100
From: BRIAN CABAAL <boc@raidtec.ie>
Subject: A defence against near C rocks

I normally lurk and I'm a relative newcomer but I'll throw in my Cr0.02

A near C rock has a devastating effect against a planet, right? So, surely a
pebble will have a devastating effect on a near C rock. Put a really tiny
thruster  and a really tiny computer/radio receiver on pebbles and scatter
them around a planet, so you can hopefully put a few of them in the path of
near C rocks if you detect them coming in. The problem of course is
detecting them, responding in time, and will the resulting shower of near C
shrapnel be significantly less deadly than the near C rock? 

- -Brian Caball

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:08:16 -0500
From: Anthony Salter <badman@austin.rr.com>
Subject: Re: A defence against near C rocks

At 06:51 PM 8/11/99 +0100, you wrote:
>I normally lurk and I'm a relative newcomer but I'll throw in my Cr0.02
>
>A near C rock has a devastating effect against a planet, right? So, surely a
>pebble will have a devastating effect on a near C rock. Put a really tiny
>thruster  and a really tiny computer/radio receiver on pebbles and scatter
>them around a planet, so you can hopefully put a few of them in the path of
>near C rocks if you detect them coming in. The problem of course is
>detecting them, responding in time, and will the resulting shower of near C
>shrapnel be significantly less deadly than the near C rock? 
>
>-Brian Caball
>

My contention would be that while it would be theoretically possible to
accelerate a mass to near-C, it would be almost impossible to HIT anything
with it.  You've got a planet hurtling around a star which is hurtling
around the galactic core.  How are you going to hit something like that
with an object that must be constantly accelerated (possibly for years)
before it gets to the desired velocity?

Oh, God, here we go...

Badman

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:15:55 -0700
From: "Thing" <gduke@orca.esd114.wednet.edu>
Subject: Holy Jump Torps Batman! (Was RE: Relief for Newbies)

On Wednesday, August 11, 1999 9:34 AM
Charles Collin said,

> Crap!  I forgot jump torps!  How could I have forgotten the almighty jump
> torp wars!?

Of course jump torps exist.  They mass about 100 tons and are made out of
old scout courier ships refitted with autopilots.  It just takes a fairly
hefty ship to consider them as torpedoes. ;)

G.D.D.
=======
"An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made, in a
narrow field." - Niels Bohr

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:21:23 -0700
From: "Thing" <gduke@orca.esd114.wednet.edu>
Subject: RE: A defence against near C rocks

On Wednesday, August 11, 1999 11:08 AM
Anthony Salter said,


> My contention would be that while it would be theoretically possible to
> accelerate a mass to near-C, it would be almost impossible to HIT anything
> with it.  You've got a planet hurtling around a star which is hurtling
> around the galactic core.  How are you going to hit something like that
> with an object that must be constantly accelerated (possibly for years)
> before it gets to the desired velocity?

You don't have to hit anything.  Just choose a decent size rock and as you
approach C it's mass will increase to such an extent that just passing
through the solar system will probably cause some orbital realignment to
occur.  Not instantly fatal, but damn annoying to have to move your
civilization to a new world every time some enemy shifts your planet out of
the life zone.

G.D.D.
======
 "Always... ALWAYS  remember: Less is LESS.  More is MORE.  More is BETTER,
and TWICE as much is GOOD too...  Not enough is BAD, and too much is  never
ENOUGH except when it's JUST ABOUT RIGHT."      -The Tick

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:19:44 -0400
From: Thad Coons <Sapience@compuserve.com>
Subject: HEPlaR vs T-Plates

This looks like a subclass of the great done-to-death near-c rock debate,
but I wasn't around for that. What I have gathered from reading the TML is:

I) Tplates 
   A) are good because
      1) They let you do interesting stuff, like fly around in planetary
systems without worrying about fuel or taking months to get there.
      2) They have been around since at least MT, and canon says the OTU
uses them.
   B) Are bad because
      1) They violate multiple principles of physics, (most especially
conservation of energy) which turns them into perpetual motion machines
that let you do things like launch near-c rocks. 

II) HEPlaR 
   A) is good because:
      1) It doesn't break as many physical laws as badly as T-Plates do.
   B) is bad because:
      1) You have to carry a lot of extra reaction mass and you are
severely limited in your ability to move around the system.

No rehash of these points is required. What I would like to know is if any
heretic has worked out what kind of power requirements contragrav and
T-plates would require if they *didn't* violate conservation of energy?
Never mind what they do to General Relativity.


 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:19:40 -0400
From: Thad Coons <Sapience@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Planetology 102 Part 8

Bruce MacIntosh wrote:

>My view of the formation of rocky (terrestrial) planets is that it occurs
>too close to the star for ices to still exist, so the grains are (mostly)
>solid minerals. This is usually cited as the distinction between
>rocky-planet formation and gas giants, which form out in the edge
>where enough ice is available for accretion to happen rapidly.
>If you have a specific reference indicating otherwise I'd like to see
>it...

You are undoubtedly more familiar with the subject than I am, and no, I
don't have any specific references. As I said, this was speculative. It
appears reasonable to believe that even stars begin as I suggested. In that
case, the process runs away, and the initial core material is quickly
melted and then vaporized and mixed well with the rest of the stellar
hydrogen. Gas giants start similarly but run out of material before they
reach stellar size. 
   The chondrules found in meteorites suggest that small bodies (sand grain
to marble size) developed from interstellar material _before_ the protosun
ignited, were heated to the melting point of the minerals, then cooled
(rapidly) and began accumulating again into larger bodies. This second
stage (in the inner system) of accretion would then proceed as you
indicate.

 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:28:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: HEPlaR vs T-Plates

Thad Coons writes:

> No rehash of these points is required. What I would like to know is if any
> heretic has worked out what kind of power requirements contragrav and
> T-plates would require if they *didn't* violate conservation of energy?
> Never mind what they do to General Relativity.

Contragrav has a minimum power requirement of (velocity relative to anchor mass) * (thrust), where velocity is in meters/second and thrust is in newtons, and both are vector quantites.  Its power requirements can be negative.

Thruster plates either have the same power requirements as contragravity (in which case an 'anchor mass' must be defined) or have a power requirement of 3x10^8 watts/newton (in which case its simply a total conversion reaction drive).

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:42:32 -0400
From: "Jory Earl" <j-man@iname.com>
Subject: Re: A defence against near C rocks

Brian Cabal postulates :
- ----------------
A near C rock has a devastating effect against a planet, right? So, surely a
pebble will have a devastating effect on a near C rock. Put a really tiny
thruster  and a really tiny computer/radio receiver on pebbles and scatter
them around a planet, so you can hopefully put a few of them in the path of
near C rocks if you detect them coming in. The problem of course is
detecting them, responding in time, and will the resulting shower of near C
shrapnel be significantly less deadly than the near C rock?
- ------------

By jove!  He's gone and invented 'sandcasters' for planets!!!

Now how many 'bays' could you fit on a planet?  <:)>
___________________________________________________________
 J-Man
 ICQ# 2843475
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.
 Email : j-man@iname.com
 Home Page : http://www.geocities.com/~jman037/
___________________________________________________________

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1999 #943
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